[ArminiusVicious]

Ok I thought about putting this in the debate forum, and then I saw a Paranormal congress forum (but couldn't post in there!).

So I am frankly disgusted by the marches, the claims, and all the BS in general.
I see people marring the name of my Lord for a stupid personal belief that is based in fear, misinformation, and paranoia of falsehood.
Even from a non religious outlook....

The protest in front of DC now has me shaking my head. I think its more of a war of "I can make a better more shocking sign than you".

I hear things: The Muslims are invading America

and we want our America back

We don't want a public option

Terror Terror Gay marriage! (ok I jacked that from a comic)

When is enough enough.

What are everyone's thoughts? And yes I mean EVERYONE! .....even the muslims invading America! dun dun duuun!!!!

[Robert666]

Ok I thought about putting this in the debate forum, and then I saw a Paranormal congress forum (but couldn't post in there!).

So I am frankly disgusted by the marches, the claims, and all the BS in general.
I see people marring the name of my Lord for a stupid personal belief that is based in fear, misinformation, and paranoia of falsehood.
Even from a non religious outlook....

The protest in front of DC now has me shaking my head. I think its more of a war of "I can make a better more shocking sign than you".

I hear things: The Muslims are invading America

and we want our America back

We don't want a public option

Terror Terror Gay marriage! (ok I jacked that from a comic)

When is enough enough.

What are everyone's thoughts? And yes I mean EVERYONE! .....even the muslims invading America! dun dun duuun!!!!

Hey Armin!

I would say that this is a product of the dumbing-down of the world, but then I realize that the population was never that bright to begin with.

Driving home a point with shock value is easy to do, but there better be substance behind the message, or the message is quickly forgotten.

[Amy-Michelle]

Well, I don't like Obama.
I don't like his healthcare proposal
and I don't like his bailout plans
and many other things I don't like about him either.

What I do like is that we live in a free world and can express this;
whereas in other countries you may be put to death for speaking out against your leaders.

As far as Muslims invading America....well i don't know what to say about that.
I do know the Muslim faith is the quickest growing religion right now and they expect it to
outnumber Christians in about 10 years or so.

But I don't see what any of that has to do with Obama?

[Raze Krieger]

I feel that the conservative right are forgetting that their beliefs and political views are not the only ones in the nation. They forget about that little part of the Bill of Rights saying Freedom of Religion and the whole Separation of Church and State.

I would say that this is a product of the dumbing-down of the world, but then I realize that the population was never that bright to begin with.

I like this. I shall use this.

[Chica]

I did not vote for Obama. My opinion is that America knew what they wanted as a whole, and that was Obama as president. Now whether that was for his ideals and views, or if they just wanted the first black president in office, Obama is president now and thats something America has to just eat for breakfast in the morning.

[Stevef209]

I would say that this is a product of the dumbing-down of the world, but then I realize that the population was never that bright to begin with.

Quote of the month!

As to the OP.

I feel that much of the "hype" is being fueled by the media. I could take a camera into a group of 10,000 people and find a group of 7 (with moronic crap signs), film only that and loop it online making it look like 10,000 inbred morons shouting hate too. I am not saying that there seems to be alot of confusion, hate, and division, I am just saying that I believe much is being made of the "few" by the media. How much is real and how much is reality?

As for the use of religion (by some in the crowds) my thought is...read my signature.

I believe that many are innocently apposed (for now) and just need some questions answered. If BOTH sides could be clear in their explanations, I think this could move forward.

I always have admired America for it's will to voice their opinion unhindered, but as of late find it funny that (with media help) they are repeating the same censorship that happened during the Bush administration "disagree with us and you are racist/terrorist lover", etc. Voice your opinion, but please, be reasonable is my moto. Think with reason and sensibility and you will be a leader and not a sheep.

As a Canadian, I chuckle when the Canadian healthcare system is "demonized" as socialist or communism. Why? What you hear in the media about our health care is a lie. Even if we have to go to the US for operations (As we sometimes have a shortage of doctors...that move to the US to make huge money off of uninsured Americans), it is STILL PAYED FOR. period. Our government doesnt make medical decisions, make us wait, etc. This is very silly. I do, however, believe that a united effort should be made to fight fraud, over pricing, and general abuse in any government covered healthcare (which I see as the only problem)

I see a long road ahead for all.

This post has been edited by Stevef209: Sep 23 2009, 08:25 AM

[Debs]

I'm not one for politics, whether following it or dicussing it. I've never seen a discussion...ahem, put that in quotes...ever end with anyone actually being enlightened enough to come away with a new opinion. I did however get very caught up in the Obama campaign after I happened to catch his speech in Berlin. He impressed me, he reminded me alot of the snippets I've heard of JFK--confident, forceful, articulate. And Democrat. So I became a news junkie and started following the campaign.

I don't recall when the emails started, but I had several friends who seemed to delight in passing around all of the TOTAL CRAP that was being spewed and passed around as Gospel truth. Even before I became so aware of Obama, I was checking these faulty emails and sending the correct info to these friends. I fifnally told the one, my neighbor, that if she was going to trash one candidate I wanted to see her trash ALL of them.

In the end, all I can say is...the election is over, the people spoke, deal with it. Whoever it was that took office was going to have one helluva mess to deal with and a very divided country to try to please. You're right--I am a Democrat and I am NOT conservative.

[Marie]

Well, I don't like Obama.
I don't like his healthcare proposal
and I don't like his bailout plans
and many other things I don't like about him either.

What I do like is that we live in a free world and can express this;
whereas in other countries you may be put to death for speaking out against your leaders.

As far as Muslims invading America....well i don't know what to say about that.
I do know the Muslim faith is the quickest growing religion right now and they expect it to
outnumber Christians in about 10 years or so.

But I don't see what any of that has to do with Obama?

There are people who believe Obama is a closet Muslim.

[ArminiusVicious]

I would say that this is a product of the dumbing-down of the world, but then I realize that the population was never that bright to begin with.

Quote of the month!

As to the OP.

I feel that much of the "hype" is being fueled by the media. I could take a camera into a group of 10,000 people and find a group of 7 (with moronic crap signs), film only that and loop it online making it look like 10,000 inbred morons shouting hate too. I am not saying that there seems to be alot of confusion, hate, and division, I am just saying that I believe much is being made of the "few" by the media. How much is real and how much is reality?

As for the use of religion (by some in the crowds) my thought is...read my signature.

I believe that many are innocently apposed (for now) and just need some questions answered. If BOTH sides could be clear in their explanations, I think this could move forward.

I always have admired America for it's will to voice their opinion unhindered, but as of late find it funny that (with media help) they are repeating the same censorship that happened during the Bush administration "disagree with us and you are racist/terrorist lover", etc. Voice your opinion, but please, be reasonable is my moto. Think with reason and sensibility and you will be a leader and not a sheep.

As a Canadian, I chuckle when the Canadian healthcare system is "demonized" as socialist or communism. Why? What you hear in the media about our health care is a lie. Even if we have to go to the US for operations (As we sometimes have a shortage of doctors...that move to the US to make huge money off of uninsured Americans), it is STILL PAYED FOR. period. Our government doesnt make medical decisions, make us wait, etc. This is very silly. I do, however, believe that a united effort should be made to fight fraud, over pricing, and general abuse in any government covered healthcare (which I see as the only problem)

I see a long road ahead for all.

I agree with you 100% Steve.
I'm not an Obama fan to be honest. I did feel like the whole FIRST BLACK PRESIDENT thing got to peoples heads.
But the whole health care thing... I mean that is a must.
What tweaks me the most is all these "Republicans" who shout out hate, intolerance and bigotry. And yet they preach mercy and salvation on Sunday. Fears of "muslims," terrorists, and a dictator president....its ridiculous!

This leads me to bring up our 32nd President, FDR! While the Country was in turmoil, he made big changes and ruffled some feathers. He was a darn and dirty "liberal" who proposed Social security....the Republicans wouldn't have it! Well...guess what we have now?!?!? TA DA!
You know how he did all these great achievements...by keeping the population in the dark!
He had an affair during his presidency. Knew of the Japanese invasion of Pearl Harbor ahead of time...and many many more DARK secrets about him.
And yet so many label him one of the best Presidents in History!

ok I might have gone off topic there!

All I'm trying to say is that we praise in times of dire need, and when someone fills our heads with BS, we are quick to forget our problems and work on them and instead we revert back to chil-like behavior....and I'm supposed to look up to my older generations....sorry, but I'm actually trying to be an Adult.

[shawnee_79]

People just always have to have a scapegoat for all their misery, do you really expect them to take the blame for how crappy their lives are. Who better to pick on but our new president with many new, and for some, scary ideas. The religious attacks are nuts! I am not a religious person, but I also feel people should be able to believe what they want to without fear of persecution-after all, that is how most all of "us" got here. The US was settled or stolen, however you want to look at it, by individuals fleeing their native countries because of religious persecution. There will never be true harmony or anything close for that matter because of an overabundance of small minds-many of whom take part in the decisions of this country. All these protestors probably really have no real idea why they dislike Muslims so much, they know that everyone else hates them, so why not? This is why I do not participate in organized anything, be it church, clubs, etc, I don't like to be led around by someone else spouting off their opinions on whatever. I will admit, Obama made me nervous at first, but now, he's not so bad-I really could care less what religion he is. He had one heck of a mess to clean up after good ole' George W. left, and is going to constsntly meet with opposition to his ideas just based on the fact that he is not a white Christian, and that makes me sad. I hope he can keep his head up and tell all those fruits to get a hobby!!! And PLEASE stop dragging their kids into the mess-they don't want to spend their days holding up signs and yelling things that mean absolutely nothing to them...let them go play while you pointlessly protest (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Just my thoughts!

[Uber Geek]

Ok I thought about putting this in the debate forum, and then I saw a Paranormal congress forum (but couldn't post in there!).

So I am frankly disgusted by the marches, the claims, and all the BS in general.
I see people marring the name of my Lord for a stupid personal belief that is based in fear, misinformation, and paranoia of falsehood.
Even from a non religious outlook....

The protest in front of DC now has me shaking my head. I think its more of a war of "I can make a better more shocking sign than you".

I hear things: The Muslims are invading America

and we want our America back

We don't want a public option

Terror Terror Gay marriage! (ok I jacked that from a comic)

When is enough enough.

What are everyone's thoughts? And yes I mean EVERYONE! .....even the muslims invading America! dun dun duuun!!!!

Hey Armin!

I would say that this is a product of the dumbing-down of the world, but then I realize that the population was never that bright to begin with.

Driving home a point with shock value is easy to do, but there better be substance behind the message, or the message is quickly forgotten.

I just wanted to let you know, you are now "internet famous". You're line is my sig line on a rather large forum.

[Amy-Michelle]

People just always have to have a scapegoat for all their misery, do you really expect them to take the blame for how crappy their lives are. Who better to pick on but our new president with many new, and for some, scary ideas. The religious attacks are nuts! I am not a religious person, but I also feel people should be able to believe what they want to without fear of persecution-after all, that is how most all of "us" got here. The US was settled or stolen, however you want to look at it, by individuals fleeing their native countries because of religious persecution. There will never be true harmony or anything close for that matter because of an overabundance of small minds-many of whom take part in the decisions of this country. All these protestors probably really have no real idea why they dislike Muslims so much, they know that everyone else hates them, so why not? This is why I do not participate in organized anything, be it church, clubs, etc, I don't like to be led around by someone else spouting off their opinions on whatever. I will admit, Obama made me nervous at first, but now, he's not so bad-I really could care less what religion he is. He had one heck of a mess to clean up after good ole' George W. left, and is going to constsntly meet with opposition to his ideas just based on the fact that he is not a white Christian, and that makes me sad. I hope he can keep his head up and tell all those fruits to get a hobby!!! And PLEASE stop dragging their kids into the mess-they don't want to spend their days holding up signs and yelling things that mean absolutely nothing to them...let them go play while you pointlessly protest (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Just my thoughts!

I thought Obama said he is a Christian?

[Marie]

People just always have to have a scapegoat for all their misery, do you really expect them to take the blame for how crappy their lives are. Who better to pick on but our new president with many new, and for some, scary ideas. The religious attacks are nuts! I am not a religious person, but I also feel people should be able to believe what they want to without fear of persecution-after all, that is how most all of "us" got here. The US was settled or stolen, however you want to look at it, by individuals fleeing their native countries because of religious persecution. There will never be true harmony or anything close for that matter because of an overabundance of small minds-many of whom take part in the decisions of this country. All these protestors probably really have no real idea why they dislike Muslims so much, they know that everyone else hates them, so why not? This is why I do not participate in organized anything, be it church, clubs, etc, I don't like to be led around by someone else spouting off their opinions on whatever. I will admit, Obama made me nervous at first, but now, he's not so bad-I really could care less what religion he is. He had one heck of a mess to clean up after good ole' George W. left, and is going to constsntly meet with opposition to his ideas just based on the fact that he is not a white Christian, and that makes me sad. I hope he can keep his head up and tell all those fruits to get a hobby!!! And PLEASE stop dragging their kids into the mess-they don't want to spend their days holding up signs and yelling things that mean absolutely nothing to them...let them go play while you pointlessly protest (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Just my thoughts!

I thought Obama said he is a Christian?

He stated he is a Christian, but I seriously doubt he is. My opinion has nothing to do with that whole closet Muslim thing.

This post has been edited by Marie: Sep 23 2009, 09:15 PM

[Amy-Michelle]

People just always have to have a scapegoat for all their misery, do you really expect them to take the blame for how crappy their lives are. Who better to pick on but our new president with many new, and for some, scary ideas. The religious attacks are nuts! I am not a religious person, but I also feel people should be able to believe what they want to without fear of persecution-after all, that is how most all of "us" got here. The US was settled or stolen, however you want to look at it, by individuals fleeing their native countries because of religious persecution. There will never be true harmony or anything close for that matter because of an overabundance of small minds-many of whom take part in the decisions of this country. All these protestors probably really have no real idea why they dislike Muslims so much, they know that everyone else hates them, so why not? This is why I do not participate in organized anything, be it church, clubs, etc, I don't like to be led around by someone else spouting off their opinions on whatever. I will admit, Obama made me nervous at first, but now, he's not so bad-I really could care less what religion he is. He had one heck of a mess to clean up after good ole' George W. left, and is going to constsntly meet with opposition to his ideas just based on the fact that he is not a white Christian, and that makes me sad. I hope he can keep his head up and tell all those fruits to get a hobby!!! And PLEASE stop dragging their kids into the mess-they don't want to spend their days holding up signs and yelling things that mean absolutely nothing to them...let them go play while you pointlessly protest (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Just my thoughts!

I thought Obama said he is a Christian?

He stated he is a Christian, but I seriously doubt he is. My opinion has nothing to do with that whole closet Muslim thing.

I will say....I kinda think the same way. But of course, not my place to judge, but just a 'feeling' or educated guess.

[Raze Krieger]

If he says he is a Christian, fine by me so long as he doesn't start pushing it down my throat. At the same time, I wouldn't give a hoot if he was Muslim either. I have nothing against the Muslims.

[Shadowtime2012]

I thought Obama said he is a Christian?

He stated he is a Christian, but I seriously doubt he is. My opinion has nothing to do with that whole closet Muslim thing.

I will say....I kinda think the same way. But of course, not my place to judge, but just a 'feeling' or educated guess.

Anything in particular that has lead you to make the 'educated guess' that President Obama is not a Christian?

[survivalgirl]

If he says he is a Christian, fine by me so long as he doesn't start pushing it down my throat. At the same time, I wouldn't give a hoot if he was Muslim either. I have nothing against the Muslims.

He is our president, therefore he represents all of the people, whether he is a Christian or not should have never been a issue nor him being a muslim, in fact I am grateful he doesnt play that card, I find it unnecessary. People just have to have a label or something to relate to in order to feel included I guess.

[Amy-Michelle]

I thought Obama said he is a Christian?

He stated he is a Christian, but I seriously doubt he is. My opinion has nothing to do with that whole closet Muslim thing.

I will say....I kinda think the same way. But of course, not my place to judge, but just a 'feeling' or educated guess.

Anything in particular that has lead you to make the 'educated guess' that President Obama is not a Christian?

Just some of his stances, such as abortion and stuff.

But Obama's record on abortion is extreme. He opposed the ban on partial-birth abortion -- a practice a fellow Democrat, the late Daniel Patrick Moynihan, once called "too close to infanticide." Obama strongly criticized the Supreme Court decision upholding the partial-birth ban. In the Illinois state Senate, he opposed a bill similar to the Born-Alive Infants Protection Act, which prevents the killing of infants mistakenly left alive by abortion. And now Obama has oddly claimed that he would not want his daughters to be "punished with a baby" because of a crisis pregnancy -- hardly a welcoming attitude toward new life.

this was from http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...8040102197.html

Also, why did he not salute the flag here? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hU9iCANi02o...feature=related

One quote he had said before was "All people of faith- Christians, Jews, Muslims, Animists, everyone knows the same God." This is not a view Christians find in the Bible. As Jesus said in John 14:6 "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No man cometh unto the Father but by me."

Also, what is this little Freudian slip? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2o2fKbLJc8...feature=related

But I will end it with: only God knows the hearts of men. So only God knows if Obama is a Christian or not.

This post has been edited by Amy-Michelle: Sep 24 2009, 08:01 AM

[Shadowtime2012]

Anything in particular that has lead you to make the 'educated guess' that President Obama is not a Christian?

Just some of his stances, such as abortion and stuff.

But Obama's record on abortion is extreme. He opposed the ban on partial-birth abortion -- a practice a fellow Democrat, the late Daniel Patrick Moynihan, once called "too close to infanticide." Obama strongly criticized the Supreme Court decision upholding the partial-birth ban. In the Illinois state Senate, he opposed a bill similar to the Born-Alive Infants Protection Act, which prevents the killing of infants mistakenly left alive by abortion. And now Obama has oddly claimed that he would not want his daughters to be "punished with a baby" because of a crisis pregnancy -- hardly a welcoming attitude toward new life.

this was from http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...8040102197.html

Also, why did he not salute the flag here? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hU9iCANi02o...feature=related

One quote he had said before was "All people of faith- Christians, Jews, Muslims, Animists, everyone knows the same God." This is not a view Christians find in the Bible. As Jesus said in John 14:6 "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No man cometh unto the Father but by me."

Also, what is this little Freudian slip? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2o2fKbLJc8...feature=related

But I will end it with: only God knows the hearts of men. So only God knows if Obama is a Christian or not.

These would also be unacceptable for a devout Muslim. Except for the flag incident, maybe he did not recognize that butchered rendition of the 'Star Spangled Banner'. Or maybe someone needs to reacquaint the man with proper etiquette.

As you say, let god sort them out.

[Debs]

So MY stance on abortion or should I say females have a choice makes me not a Christian???